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  • Posted On: 07-21-14, 9:37 pm (EDT) #1

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 21, 2014, 9:37 pm

    I've gotten to the point where I really want to add jumping exercise to my workouts. The reason why I only jump rope occasionally and do no other exercise with jumps is something always happens to my ankles after a jumping workout. They feel sore sometimes even for days afterward but nothing is broken and they always recover if I cut the jumping element from my routine. As I see it there are two possibilities for what the problem could be:

    #1 My ankles are just weak and they can't take it. My current leg training 2-3 days a week, 3 sets, 15-50 reps: Front Squats, Glute Bridge, Toe Raises, Calf Raises, Lunges, High Knees, Modified Pistol Squats & Alternating High Steps. Is it possible that my ankles are not getting stronger on this routine? Is there some exercise I could do to try to build greater ankle stabilization?

    #2 My body is more flexible than average, most/all of my major joints are double jointed and my massage therapist told me my ankles have greater range of motion than anyone she's ever worked on. This leads me to wonder, is it possible that my ankles are 'too flexible' could they be landing in overextended positions when I come down off a jump and getting hurt that way? I've read some martial artists wear high top shoes to stabilize their ankles during training and perhaps I need that too. Does anyone on these forums wear high tops for ankle stabilization? Do you think I ought to try that and see if it helps?

    Can you think of anything else that might be preventing me from jumping that could make my ankles really sore without causing any breaks or obvious physical signs of injury? please help!

  • Posted On: 07-26-14, 2:41 pm (EDT) #2

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 26, 2014, 2:41 pm

    Hey @jade_blade, sounds like it could be anything really. Hard to diagnose over the internet.

    Maybe you just need to continue to build strength and in time your ankel pain will go away. Definitely pay attention to how you are landing and jumping if you are double jointed.

    Do you do things like side-to-side running on the treadmill or outside to build strength in the left to right movements on your ankles?

     

    That will definitly help with strength.. Just put a treadmill on a low sped and side-step on one side for about a minute, then switch, and go back and forth a few times.

  • Posted On: 07-28-14, 11:12 am (EDT) #3

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 28, 2014, 11:12 am
    Posted by: Scott_Herman

    Hey @jade_blade, sounds like it could be anything really. Hard to diagnose over the internet.

    Maybe you just need to continue to build strength and in time your ankel pain will go away. Definitely pay attention to how you are landing and jumping if you are double jointed.

    Do you do things like side-to-side running on the treadmill or outside to build strength in the left to right movements on your ankles?

     

    That will definitly help with strength.. Just put a treadmill on a low sped and side-step on one side for about a minute, then switch, and go back and forth a few times.

    I don't do any side to side ankle training because every time I do I my ankles get hurt. I can jump straight up and down but if I do anything laterally or even twisting I end up hurting myself. It's really frustrating because I feel like I can't find a way to safely strengthen my ankles, they're definitely not getting stronger when I injure them. I feel like I can protect my other joints from hyperextending if I'm focusing on them but I don't seem to have the body-awareness necessary to protect my ankles. I ordered some high-top gym shoes and I'll try your suggestion on the side-step training. I think maybe if I put my ankles in a straight-jacket and try to strengthen them, maybe then they'll be stable enough to strengthen properly. Thanks for the input Scott.

  • Posted On: 07-28-14, 11:44 am (EDT) #4

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 28, 2014, 11:44 am
    Posted by: Jade_Blade

    I don't do any side to side ankle training because every time I do I my ankles get hurt. I can jump straight up and down but if I do anything laterally or even twisting I end up hurting myself. It's really frustrating because I feel like I can't find a way to safely strengthen my ankles, they're definitely not getting stronger when I injure them. I feel like I can protect my other joints from hyperextending if I'm focusing on them but I don't seem to have the body-awareness necessary to protect my ankles. I ordered some high-top gym shoes and I'll try your suggestion on the side-step training. I think maybe if I put my ankles in a straight-jacket and try to strengthen them, maybe then they'll be stable enough to strengthen properly. Thanks for the input Scott.

    All the more reason for you to be doing some simple side walking on the treadmill. Shoes wont potect your ankles. You need to train side-to-side and take it slow.

     

    Have you tried my suggestion yet?

  • Posted On: 07-28-14, 7:51 pm (EDT) #5

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 28, 2014, 7:51 pm
    Posted by: Scott_Herman

    All the more reason for you to be doing some simple side walking on the treadmill. Shoes wont potect your ankles. You need to train side-to-side and take it slow.

     

    Have you tried my suggestion yet?

    You bet I did! I'm currently doing 15 minutes of lateral walking and no pain so far, so good. In your opinion should I train longer than 15 minutes continous? Should I be training every day or only on legs day (2-3x a week)?

  • Posted On: 07-28-14, 10:54 pm (EDT) #6

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 28, 2014, 10:54 pm
    Posted by: Jade_Blade

    You bet I did! I'm currently doing 15 minutes of lateral walking and no pain so far, so good. In your opinion should I train longer than 15 minutes continous? Should I be training every day or only on legs day (2-3x a week)?

    I would just do it 2 - 3 times a week. Those muscles need to heal as well and 15 minutes is a great start! yeah!

  • Posted On: 07-29-14, 3:39 am (EDT) #7

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 29, 2014, 3:39 am

    I dont think its about strength. The human body should be able to sprint, jump, fall without "strong" ankles. Actual strength has nothing to do with pain. Its more about stability and balance. Even though you say you have excellent mobility of the ankle, I would ask what kind of mobility is that. Is is dorsi flexion? How about lateral bending of the ankle? Also, where there is an area with high mobility ( hyper-mobility), there is always an area nearby with super low mobility. Might be your knees, or even hips. You might have excellent mobility everywhere but if your hips are imbalanced, it will still cause ankle pain.


    So, if your ankles still hurt when you do normal activities, I would visit a PT or a sports therapist that will identify the problem. The problem is usually at the last place most people look.

    Kostas

  • Posted On: 07-29-14, 10:00 pm (EDT) #8

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 29, 2014, 10:00 pm
    Posted by: Whisper

    I dont think its about strength. The human body should be able to sprint, jump, fall without "strong" ankles. Actual strength has nothing to do with pain. Its more about stability and balance. Even though you say you have excellent mobility of the ankle, I would ask what kind of mobility is that. Is is dorsi flexion? How about lateral bending of the ankle? Also, where there is an area with high mobility ( hyper-mobility), there is always an area nearby with super low mobility. Might be your knees, or even hips. You might have excellent mobility everywhere but if your hips are imbalanced, it will still cause ankle pain.


    So, if your ankles still hurt when you do normal activities, I would visit a PT or a sports therapist that will identify the problem. The problem is usually at the last place most people look.

    Kostas

    Interesting theory Kostas. What I mean is pick a satisfactory range of motion in dorsiflexion and plantarflexion and my foot can go more than an inch or two beyond necessary flexibility in both directions (I've been measured for active & passive). In bare feet I neither supinate nor pronate, I'm in neutral. I know my hips are out of place, they have been for years. I have bilateral posterior rotation with right hip upslip. I get it adjusted every other month but I can't figure out how to keep my hips in proper position. The hyper-mobile aspect of my ankle is in the inversion and eversion of the joint. When I bend my ankle actively into eversion it goes 45 degrees like most people but when I turn my ankle to the inside, inversion I can literally turn my ankle 90 degrees to the attachment with my leg. In my estimation if this were a structural issue that would be the problem. I have no idea how/if I can build muscle to keep my ankles in the normal range of motion human ankles are supposed to operate in and keep me out of hyperflexion. You've got me curious about my knees though, I'll look in to their mobility for sure.

     

    Unfortunately no one has yet been able to help with my posterior rotated hips, it's apparently far less common than anterior rotation. Yeah I've been around and heard people tell me the problems I allready know I have, the issue is: most people have no clue how to help me including PTs and PT assistants. No series of exercises, stretches, or combinations of the two, I have yet tried has ever worked to keep my hips in neutral. I've never seen anyone that had a useful idea for me on bilateral posterior rotation, so I'm kind of on my own with that as well as the ankle issue. I can't afford a ton of recreational doctor visits so I basically just have to suck it up and figure it out myself. My ankles only get hurt when I jump in any lateral or twisting manner, there has to be some reason and I'll just have to keep trying to figure it out and work it out. It's cool, I don't give up. It's a good idea to try a sports therapist, I would if I could man.

  • Posted On: 07-31-14, 10:55 am (EDT) #9

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    July 31, 2014, 10:55 am
    Posted by: Jade_Blade

    Interesting theory Kostas. What I mean is pick a satisfactory range of motion in dorsiflexion and plantarflexion and my foot can go more than an inch or two beyond necessary flexibility in both directions (I've been measured for active & passive). In bare feet I neither supinate nor pronate, I'm in neutral. I know my hips are out of place, they have been for years. I have bilateral posterior rotation with right hip upslip. I get it adjusted every other month but I can't figure out how to keep my hips in proper position. The hyper-mobile aspect of my ankle is in the inversion and eversion of the joint. When I bend my ankle actively into eversion it goes 45 degrees like most people but when I turn my ankle to the inside, inversion I can literally turn my ankle 90 degrees to the attachment with my leg. In my estimation if this were a structural issue that would be the problem. I have no idea how/if I can build muscle to keep my ankles in the normal range of motion human ankles are supposed to operate in and keep me out of hyperflexion. You've got me curious about my knees though, I'll look in to their mobility for sure.

     

    Unfortunately no one has yet been able to help with my posterior rotated hips, it's apparently far less common than anterior rotation. Yeah I've been around and heard people tell me the problems I allready know I have, the issue is: most people have no clue how to help me including PTs and PT assistants. No series of exercises, stretches, or combinations of the two, I have yet tried has ever worked to keep my hips in neutral. I've never seen anyone that had a useful idea for me on bilateral posterior rotation, so I'm kind of on my own with that as well as the ankle issue. I can't afford a ton of recreational doctor visits so I basically just have to suck it up and figure it out myself. My ankles only get hurt when I jump in any lateral or twisting manner, there has to be some reason and I'll just have to keep trying to figure it out and work it out. It's cool, I don't give up. It's a good idea to try a sports therapist, I would if I could man.

    Yes, I see what you re saying. 100%. Sounds to me like your ankles are fine but they are hyper-mobile because your hips and/or knees are not mobile enough. You have a posterior pelvic tilt, which is indeed rare. On top of that, you have left to right imbalances as well which creates torsion. Its not as complicated as you might think though. Its all about learning about correct posture. Because at the end of the day, even if you do the exercises and stretches for the imbalances you ve got, your body will return to its previous state because your mind has not realized what good posture is ( nervous holding patterns ).

    The new FAQ section will be launched soon, and it includes a very detailed posture guide that I wrote and goes beyond exercises and stretches. Its more about phychology and nervous system manipulation. I think it will help you figure out the problem on your own, without having to visit with any kind of doctor.

    Kostas

  • Posted On: 08-02-14, 9:49 am (EDT) #10

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    August 2, 2014, 9:49 am
    Posted by: Whisper

    Yes, I see what you re saying. 100%. Sounds to me like your ankles are fine but they are hyper-mobile because your hips and/or knees are not mobile enough. You have a posterior pelvic tilt, which is indeed rare. On top of that, you have left to right imbalances as well which creates torsion. Its not as complicated as you might think though. Its all about learning about correct posture. Because at the end of the day, even if you do the exercises and stretches for the imbalances you ve got, your body will return to its previous state because your mind has not realized what good posture is ( nervous holding patterns ).

    The new FAQ section will be launched soon, and it includes a very detailed posture guide that I wrote and goes beyond exercises and stretches. Its more about phychology and nervous system manipulation. I think it will help you figure out the problem on your own, without having to visit with any kind of doctor.

    Kostas

    Thank you, that sounds hopeful in a totally legit way, it also explains why so many suggestions I've tried keep failling to help. I really need that posture guide you wrote I'll keep a look out for it for sure!

  • Posted On: 08-03-14, 6:56 am (EDT) #11

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    August 3, 2014, 6:56 am
    Posted by: Jade_Blade

    Thank you, that sounds hopeful in a totally legit way, it also explains why so many suggestions I've tried keep failling to help. I really need that posture guide you wrote I'll keep a look out for it for sure!

    We ll try to have the new FAQ section up really soon. As soon as it takes shape, I ll work on uploading the most important sections that people have requested multiple times. I ll probably be able to email you the guide before it is uploaded on the site.

  • Posted On: 08-03-14, 9:30 pm (EDT) #12

    Painful Jumping/Ankle Mystery

    August 3, 2014, 9:30 pm
    Posted by: Whisper

    We ll try to have the new FAQ section up really soon. As soon as it takes shape, I ll work on uploading the most important sections that people have requested multiple times. I ll probably be able to email you the guide before it is uploaded on the site.

    That would be awesome! I will look forward to it.

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