OK, 5X5 didn't go well, tanked after 4 weeks. Started pyramid couple weeks ago, and hit a freaking brick wall last night, on 5th session. I've lost energy (again), lost interest, lost strength (think I know why see below), and shoulder, back, and hip (all left side, so think hip is cause of pain in back?) pain.

So how did it go, Sunday was a good workout, Tuesday was an OK workout things seemed to go ok, but I struggled with deadlift (Sunday's workout I struggled little with squat, but not too bad) and then last night, squat was struggle ALL the way through, so much that I couldn't even finish, got 2 reps instead of 3 on heavy set and didn't even do the last two sets (4 and 8 reps). Then I moved over to bench because that was next, thinking "Thank god squats is done, now I can do bench and haven't struggled on that" very first set (warm up of 10 reps with BAR) felt weak, didn't think much, added weight for another warm up, (95 little pounds) and again struggled. Anyways, finished heavy set of 2 reps @ 145 pounds and I was DONE. Didn't have anything left for even accessory work.

I was doing 2 different workouts alternated 3 times a week (Workout A Sunday, Workout B Tuesday, Workout A Thursday, workout B Sunday, etc...)

Workout A)

Squat 7 sets based on pyramid strength chart

Bench 7 sets based on pyramid strength chart

Bent over row 7 sets based on pyramid strength chart

Shrugs 8 X 3

Tricep Extensions (various ones/mixtures) 8 X 3

bicep curls (various ones/mixture) 8 X 3

Cable Crunches 10 X 3

Hyper-Extensions 10 X 2 (bench and machine I use both for my 2 sets of 10 sometimes more if I feel like it)

random accessory work whatever I feel like doing

Workout B)

Deadlift 7 sets based on pyramid strength chart

OHP 7 sets based on pyramid strength chart

Bent over row (10% lighter than A) 7 sets based on strength chart

Assisted pullups/lat pulldowns (I do as many pullups as I can without assist) 7 sets based on strength chart

close grip bench, because of shoulder I do tricep extensions again 8 X 3

curls 8 X 3

Random accessory work

Anyways, I'm thinking of changing this to 3 workouts, so that each muscle only gets worked directly once a week. So there would be a pull day, push day, and leg/back day. I am thinking of alternating squats and deadlifts and bench press and overhead press so I do one or the other on that day. (Push day 1 Bench, day 2/next week overhead press, leg day 1 deadlift day 2 on next week squat) Bent over row and pullups are the only other major lifts and might have to do that with them as well, but for now on pull days I will do both.

I'm hoping I was just doing too much volume and it wore me out that or i'm just incapable of building muscle or getting stronger, I shall find out. Any thoughts? I know I've posted a lot on this but I've done nothing but struggle. I keep running out of gas and just don't know what to do. But like the quote at my gym "Failures in life are those people who didn't know how close they were to success"

If you are hitting the wall, then you might be right about changing to 3 workouts a week.

Your muscles might do better if they get more rest. Your squats and deadift will take a bit of a toll on your CNS, and by doing them heavy, it maybe isn't surprising that you find yourself lacking energy.

However, I would say the first thing you should look at is your meal plan and sleeping paterns.

Two big questions I have are...

1. Are you eating enough, every day? Are you getting the micronutrients you need?

2. Are you getting enough sleep? Between 7-9 hours each night?

Also, are you making sure you're hydrated? Maybe you should think about a pre-workout too?

If any of these aren't in check, it could be the reason for your lack of energy. But if you have tried two different ways of heavy training, maybe you should stick with 8-12 rep training, or have you tried that too?

Don't start thinking you can't do things like gaining muscle or strength though...keep positive man, you can do it!

Jordan

I'm eating net (after deducting exercise burn with heart rate monitor so best I can do) 3000 (usually over) calories per day 116 fat, 260 carbs, 223 protein (35% fat, 35% carbs and 30% protein is actual break down when I eat more than calorie goal (2970 is actual goal but I end up going over, those macros go up based on % of calories) I drink water all day like 12 or so bottles of water. I workout after work, come home relax little eat an apple, some fat like pecans, and I drink tea (unsweet always). I drink water while working out, usually 1-2 bottles on way to gym plus water at gym.

My sleep, 8 hours at minimum, usually 9 or so. Of course sometimes less but especially after workout I'm exhausted and pass out soon after laying down and sleep in more often lately so I'm sleeping pretty good. I guess I could always do more.

Wednesday day before workout I decided to try and see if eating more carbs would make me feel better so I ate about 400 grams of carbs with simple carbs around 200 grams. It made no difference thursday. (I went over 800 calories Wednesday, almost 4,000 for day and I ate my calories Thursday but felt like crap, still do 2 days later.

And lower body triangle pyramid is 10,8,6,4,3,4,8 reps. So I'm only doing one real heavy set. I've been using this for squats and deadlifts, and should mention I'm not upping weight so pyramid so far has been same weight. Sundays workout was the same as what I failed to do on Thursday (same weight on bar as sunday)

Thanks

I did athlean x (February 2014 to August when fractured arm, 120 day to complete then random selection for workouts) and it's mostly 10-15 reps and got gains but over time went down hill, harder I tried the less energy I had. When I fractured my arm was when I stopped, but I had reduced weight I was using and couldn't do as many pushups before fracture (didn't touch weight for 4 weeks or so from fracture). Should also say I was a little anemic in may, was told to take multi with iron was taking multi before without. August got rechecked and was told all is good but to continue multi with iron. Which I take everyday along with fish oil.

Now during this time I was still trying to lose weight. I've been at above maintance for 2 months now at least, but anyway my metabolism is fried causing issues? I did lose 130 pounds over little over a year. Also want to go to dr but don't know what kind is best suited for my situation, transition from couch potato for 20 years to losing over 100 pounds and trying to not only be healthy but gain muscle. Internal medicine, family practice, D.O. or M.D. etc.. want dr that is a dr but also knows what I'm trying to do and help me and just tell me why this or that.

OK so it sounds like your calories, sleep and hydration is all pretty good. More sleep is not always better, so I don't think you need to go out of your way to get even more sleep - it can actually make you feel more tired in the long run.

If you aren't ever increasing the weight, that could actually be a problem. Your muscles need to adapt to new things to grow. Basically what I'm saying is you need to implement progressive overload in some way, so that your muscles are forced to grow so they can handle this new form of training.

That might mean increasing the weight, increasing the reps, increasing the sets, anything to overload the muscles.

Then again, maybe your body really does just need more rest time, and maybe working out each muscle group once a week like you suggested is the way to go. Trial and error is the best way to figure out the method of training which best suits you.

Also, how much cardio are you doing? Maybe you are using a lot of energy for cardio and should cut back a little bit.

As for your query about the doctor, that's a bit outside my knowledge sorry haha. I would just suggest going to the same person who perscribed your iron, because he might have a better understanding of your situation.

One more thing to think about is whether or not some of your problem is from lack of motivation or something. Could it be a case of mind over matter? Your mind might be thinking "I can't do this" or "I don't really want to do this", and so your body is basically forced to understand the same thing. Your mind and self belief are pretty important when it comes to lifting weights too. Maybe watch this video if you haven't seen it already, it might be helpful.

Jordan

On progressing weight I hadn't done that yet not that I wasn't going to just hadn't yet. Failed Thursday which was 5th workout. Just felt weak. On dr that checked my iron had no clue so want to find new one that understands where I've been, am, and eventually will be. I'm motivated. Been excited and wanting to do it but Thursday after failure it knocked me down. My mood changed on Wednesday after tuesdays workout very crabby why I ate those carbs thinking maybe that's why but was not negative planned on having good workout. But Thursday I was ready and wanting to hit weights hard. Just failed then got negative.

Btw my muscle genes is supposed to be done by 26th so hope I will get better idea, but for now I'm doing trial and error. If i don't have strength and energy to workout then I got to change. See how tomorrow goes after failure Thursday don't know if I'll do push or pull but at this time not doing legs don't feel that good.

I haven't been doing cardio last 4 weeks or so not enough energy.

Have you thought about takings week out of the gym and giving your body a complete rest? If you have been hitting it hard in the gym your body may need more than 24 hours to recover. If I take a week out I come back more refreshed and motivated all so more strength than before. It also helps with those gains to!!!!

OK man hopefully it wall all work out! Rest might be good.

Muscle Genes will definitely help I think, and will give you a guide for how you should train for your body.

@Gymdude yeah I thought about suggesting that, I know some people take a week or even more so they can come back even more energetic than ever...As for me, I find it hard to have like two or three rest days a week! haha. Sometimes I wonder if I might be too addicted for my own good lol.

Jordan

Haha I know what you mean Jordan, i have taken 3 days off if I have had a crazy weekend at work and that's hard. Seem to come back stronger though 💪. Maybe worth a try and see if that helps break that wall.

Haha I know what you mean Jordan, i have taken 3 days off if I have had a crazy weekend at work and that's hard. Seem to come back stronger though 💪. Maybe worth a try and see if that helps break that wall.

OK, well, had my pull workout on Sunday went ok, actually tried working out earlier in the day and had no energy, but made myself go back later and was able to do good. Today I did my push work out. Completed my bench press pyramid (8 X 125, 6 X 115, 4 X 125, 3 X 145, 2 X 160, 8 X 125, 12 X 115) and felt really strong so decided to overload and go for 1 rm of 180 pounds (I did 160 X 2 during workout) Anyways, I got 1 1/2 reps (had spotter that helped on hand off), and figure if I was little more rested I could get 185, maybe 190 (?). Considering that when I started lifting again from arm fracture, ~2.5 months ago, I could only get 122 pounds for 1 rep I feel like this is a great improvement. Now of course, then I was weaker from 5 weeks off and all, but that is the most I've benched in 20+ years. And, it was more than my body weight. Hahhaha (and it felt good, didn't hurt or anything) I've been basing my pyramid on 160 1 RM, so time to up the intensity on bench. I hope I continue to progress with only doing bench once every other week, next weeks push I'm going to do barbell overhead press pyramid instead of bench (rest of push workout is same, except instead of dumbell presses might do dumbell bench for accessory. (only doing 1 at a time and only doing push once a week, see how it goes for a few weeks)

Rest of my work out went good too, did tricep extensions, 7 sets 8-12 reps, incline bench 3 X 8, over head dumbell presses 3 X 12, chest flys 3 X 12, and abs. My triceps felt on fire, LOL.

Thursday is legs and back, hoping it goes as well as tonight, shall see. Hips feel better than they were a week ago that is for sure, see what happens when I try squating.

Awesome work @tonyp56!

That is an amazing amount of progress to make on your bench! 60-70 pounds is a lot over 2 and a half months.

Was there anything you did differently this week to what you have been doing previously when you felt lacking in energy? If there was, you should keep doing it!

Keep it up! #HTH

Jordan

Hey man,

Firstly I like the frequency of your routines, it means you are hitting muscle groups more than once a week which will encourage more growth. Where I think you are going wrong is that you are doing way too much volume. When frequency is high volume must lower in order to create the ideal for the body to want to grow. Also when doing a full body splits its ideal to pick a "heavy" day and a "lighter" day whereby you vary rep schemes. For example on heavy days go anywhere from 4 - 10 reps and on lighter days go anywhere from 10 - 25.

Thank you for reply and advice. With me no longer doing full body and instead breaking my week into pull, push, and legs be ok or do I need to change things around some more. Right now I feel pretty good but don't know if what I'm doing is ideal for muscle/strength.

Thanks again

If you stick with the pyramid training, you will actually be going for both muscle AND strength gain @tonyp56.

If you decided to drop the pyramid training in order to decrease your volume, just do what Daniel said and have one heavy day and one light day for each muscle group. Also, if you keep doing basically the same exercises but split your workout up into push/pull/legs, your volume will naturally decrease because you aren't doing as much on any given day.

If you are only training them once a week, maybe do a heavy week and then a light week. Otherwise, if you decide to stick with training each group twice a week, make sure you do one of each. That way you get the best of both worlds - muscle AND strength :)

However, I will also add that progress may be slower on both fronts compared with sticking strictly with muslce OR strength gains.

Jordan

Thanks Jordan, thought I replied to your other message but guess I didnt. Anyways only thing different this week is I'm not doing full body on energy front.

I'm continuing pyramid. Think it will work. Must say I'm trying to fill in space with accessories like curls, extensions, etc... I'm going to add some cardio in too (as long as energy stays good) First time I've felt like it in weeks.