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  • Posted On: 08-28-18, 5:56 am (EDT) #1

    Increasing macros after cutting.

    August 28, 2018, 5:56 am

    Hello nation,

    TLDR: Went through a cut, great results; Going into lean bulk till Feb-March (with C&R); aiming to cut after that; looking for advice on how to properly adjust macros.

    Longer version:

    Couple of months ago I scaled back my macros to "lean bulk" - basically went from eating around 3000 down to 2700 (less on rest days due to carb cycling) calories, or: 205 Carbs, 105 Fat, 235 Protein. I used Scott's advice on my previous thread to up my fats and protein and reduce my carbs while keeping the same overall calories.

     

    I have to say: I really liked the effect of the lower carb diet when it comes to leaning out (even though I LOOOVE carbs). It was also the first time I properly "carb cycled" on rest days - will absolutely be keeping this going.

     

    My question is how to properly transition into a lean bulk: I will obviously need to increase my carbs and lower my protein intake (higher protein intake when cutting vs when bulking). Doing some quick calculations, based on own experience and with the meal planner's help: 

    171 lbs, 6ft, 28 years, C&R training, assuming 12% BF (think I am a bit lower, but always safe to go with a higher estimate when I am not sure) leaves me with:

    Calorie Goal : 3126

    Protien Intake Goal : 226

    Fat Intake Goal : 68

    Carbohydrate Intake Goal : 402 (this will be 100-150 carbs lower on rest days)

     

    Now, I will be following the C&R Calendar, with 2 cardio sessions to enhance the "lean" part of the bulk - does the above seem like a good idea? Or should I up the fats a bit and lower the carbs - I am basing this on the good results and feeling I got from the reduced carb cutting. I just dont want to be afraid of carbs during a bulk and hold myself back.

     

    Anyone went through a similar transition and can offer some insight/advice?

     

    Cheers.

  • Posted On: 08-28-18, 6:34 pm (EDT) #2

    Increasing macros after cutting.

    August 28, 2018, 6:34 pm
    Posted by: kraykov

    Hello nation,

    TLDR: Went through a cut, great results; Going into lean bulk till Feb-March (with C&R); aiming to cut after that; looking for advice on how to properly adjust macros.

    Longer version:

    Couple of months ago I scaled back my macros to "lean bulk" - basically went from eating around 3000 down to 2700 (less on rest days due to carb cycling) calories, or: 205 Carbs, 105 Fat, 235 Protein. I used Scott's advice on my previous thread to up my fats and protein and reduce my carbs while keeping the same overall calories.

     

    I have to say: I really liked the effect of the lower carb diet when it comes to leaning out (even though I LOOOVE carbs). It was also the first time I properly "carb cycled" on rest days - will absolutely be keeping this going.

     

    My question is how to properly transition into a lean bulk: I will obviously need to increase my carbs and lower my protein intake (higher protein intake when cutting vs when bulking). Doing some quick calculations, based on own experience and with the meal planner's help: 

    171 lbs, 6ft, 28 years, C&R training, assuming 12% BF (think I am a bit lower, but always safe to go with a higher estimate when I am not sure) leaves me with:

    Calorie Goal : 3126

    Protien Intake Goal : 226

    Fat Intake Goal : 68

    Carbohydrate Intake Goal : 402 (this will be 100-150 carbs lower on rest days)

     

    Now, I will be following the C&R Calendar, with 2 cardio sessions to enhance the "lean" part of the bulk - does the above seem like a good idea? Or should I up the fats a bit and lower the carbs - I am basing this on the good results and feeling I got from the reduced carb cutting. I just dont want to be afraid of carbs during a bulk and hold myself back.

     

    Anyone went through a similar transition and can offer some insight/advice?

     

    Cheers.

    Hey kraykov,

     

    Transitioning into a lean bulk should be an easy process for you, as it looks that you have a good understand of nutrition and the macros are nailed. I like the setup, although I'd personally lower the protein intake and raise the fat a bit. In terms of the calorie surplus, that would depend on your training experience and a few other variables. My advice is to use the lowest possible surplus that you can think of, and milk that for as long as you can until strength gains cease. Try 5% above maintenance, and if that isn't enough 10% will be great for lean bulking. I also like your idea of doing HIIT cardio twice a week, that will serve you well my friend.

    Wishing you the best of gains!

  • Posted On: 08-29-18, 4:00 am (EDT) #3

    Increasing macros after cutting.

    August 29, 2018, 4:00 am
    Posted by: AlphaDestiny

    Hey kraykov,

     

    Transitioning into a lean bulk should be an easy process for you, as it looks that you have a good understand of nutrition and the macros are nailed. I like the setup, although I'd personally lower the protein intake and raise the fat a bit. In terms of the calorie surplus, that would depend on your training experience and a few other variables. My advice is to use the lowest possible surplus that you can think of, and milk that for as long as you can until strength gains cease. Try 5% above maintenance, and if that isn't enough 10% will be great for lean bulking. I also like your idea of doing HIIT cardio twice a week, that will serve you well my friend.

    Wishing you the best of gains!

    Hello mate,

     

    Thanks a lot for the reply - much appreciated.

     

    Also, I agree with your thoughs of upping the fats a bit - 68 grams sounded too low to me from the start. I was thinking more like: 335carbs, 200protein and 105 fats - giving me a total of around 3100 calories.

     

    Thanks again and all the best to you too!

     

     

  • Posted On: 08-31-18, 1:19 am (EDT) #4

    Increasing macros after cutting.

    August 31, 2018, 1:19 am
    Posted by: kraykov

    Hello nation,

    TLDR: Went through a cut, great results; Going into lean bulk till Feb-March (with C&R); aiming to cut after that; looking for advice on how to properly adjust macros.

    Longer version:

    Couple of months ago I scaled back my macros to "lean bulk" - basically went from eating around 3000 down to 2700 (less on rest days due to carb cycling) calories, or: 205 Carbs, 105 Fat, 235 Protein. I used Scott's advice on my previous thread to up my fats and protein and reduce my carbs while keeping the same overall calories.

     

    I have to say: I really liked the effect of the lower carb diet when it comes to leaning out (even though I LOOOVE carbs). It was also the first time I properly "carb cycled" on rest days - will absolutely be keeping this going.

     

    My question is how to properly transition into a lean bulk: I will obviously need to increase my carbs and lower my protein intake (higher protein intake when cutting vs when bulking). Doing some quick calculations, based on own experience and with the meal planner's help: 

    171 lbs, 6ft, 28 years, C&R training, assuming 12% BF (think I am a bit lower, but always safe to go with a higher estimate when I am not sure) leaves me with:

    Calorie Goal : 3126

    Protien Intake Goal : 226

    Fat Intake Goal : 68

    Carbohydrate Intake Goal : 402 (this will be 100-150 carbs lower on rest days)

     

    Now, I will be following the C&R Calendar, with 2 cardio sessions to enhance the "lean" part of the bulk - does the above seem like a good idea? Or should I up the fats a bit and lower the carbs - I am basing this on the good results and feeling I got from the reduced carb cutting. I just dont want to be afraid of carbs during a bulk and hold myself back.

     

    Anyone went through a similar transition and can offer some insight/advice?

     

    Cheers.

    @kraykov I would have to agree with Alex, it looks like you know what you are doing man!

     

    I would definitely increase your fats, so that second set of numbers you have looks much better in my opinion. Carbs is really a personal thing - some people can bulk on lots of carbs and stay lean, others will start gaining a bit too much fat while bulking if the carbs are still too high. If you can get away with 400g, that's fine. But if 300g, or 335g from your second set of macros, is enough to keep you satisfied, that's great too (your body can still use fat for fuel too).

     

    The only thing would be.. is 3100 enough for a bulk? I got a little confused with what happened a couple of months ago. You said you went into a "lean bulk", reducing your calories from 3000 to 2700.. but if you were already in a lean bulk for a couple of months, why are you now going to lean bulk until Feb-March. Wouldn't you just be continuing your current lean bulk?

     

    Or did you mean 2700 calories was what you used for a bit of a cut? In which case, 3000 calories is probably about your maintenance.. and therefore you probably want about 3200-3250 calories for the start of a lean bulk?

     

    Or did I read that wrong?

  • Posted On: 08-31-18, 4:19 am (EDT) #5

    Increasing macros after cutting.

    August 31, 2018, 4:19 am
    Posted by: Scott_Herman

    @kraykov I would have to agree with Alex, it looks like you know what you are doing man!

     

    I would definitely increase your fats, so that second set of numbers you have looks much better in my opinion. Carbs is really a personal thing - some people can bulk on lots of carbs and stay lean, others will start gaining a bit too much fat while bulking if the carbs are still too high. If you can get away with 400g, that's fine. But if 300g, or 335g from your second set of macros, is enough to keep you satisfied, that's great too (your body can still use fat for fuel too).

     

    The only thing would be.. is 3100 enough for a bulk? I got a little confused with what happened a couple of months ago. You said you went into a "lean bulk", reducing your calories from 3000 to 2700.. but if you were already in a lean bulk for a couple of months, why are you now going to lean bulk until Feb-March. Wouldn't you just be continuing your current lean bulk?

     

    Or did you mean 2700 calories was what you used for a bit of a cut? In which case, 3000 calories is probably about your maintenance.. and therefore you probably want about 3200-3250 calories for the start of a lean bulk?

     

    Or did I read that wrong?

    I completely managed to f*** up my wording in my original post - I was cutting on 2700 (on training days, around 2200-2300 on rest days). I managed to lean out a bit, dropped 2 kgs in 3 months - so, all in all not too bad.

     

    The meal planner puts me with my current weight and stats on slightly over 3100 - but it can easily be 3200-3250 like you are saying. I will have to closely monitor my weight and see how I react to it - this has always been a bit difficult for me though - each weigh-in I try to replicate the exact conditions, but I am never sure whether the 1kg gain isnt due to water retention or w/e it might be, I'm just insecure like that :)

     

    I will stick to the 2nd set of macros, since I personally enjoy the lower carb allowance (300-335) letting me have ligher dinners.

     

    A follow-up quesiton around the carb cycling part of my diet - the way I currently train is: I follow the C&R workouts, but do my abs and cardio on my "rest" days. I just find myself being at the 70-80 minute mark when finishing up the main part of the program and really dont want to stay at the gym for close to 2 hours. I know that in theory my abs (esp. when supersetting them as part of C&R) shouldnt take that long, but when in that part of my training I'm so drained I just want to leave :D. So my question is: on my "rest" days - do I still cut back my carbs by 100-150 even though I do cardio and abs? Or are they not really rest days then?

     

    Thanks.

  • Posted On: 09-02-18, 6:51 pm (EDT) #6

    Increasing macros after cutting.

    September 2, 2018, 6:51 pm
    Posted by: kraykov

    I completely managed to f*** up my wording in my original post - I was cutting on 2700 (on training days, around 2200-2300 on rest days). I managed to lean out a bit, dropped 2 kgs in 3 months - so, all in all not too bad.

     

    The meal planner puts me with my current weight and stats on slightly over 3100 - but it can easily be 3200-3250 like you are saying. I will have to closely monitor my weight and see how I react to it - this has always been a bit difficult for me though - each weigh-in I try to replicate the exact conditions, but I am never sure whether the 1kg gain isnt due to water retention or w/e it might be, I'm just insecure like that :)

     

    I will stick to the 2nd set of macros, since I personally enjoy the lower carb allowance (300-335) letting me have ligher dinners.

     

    A follow-up quesiton around the carb cycling part of my diet - the way I currently train is: I follow the C&R workouts, but do my abs and cardio on my "rest" days. I just find myself being at the 70-80 minute mark when finishing up the main part of the program and really dont want to stay at the gym for close to 2 hours. I know that in theory my abs (esp. when supersetting them as part of C&R) shouldnt take that long, but when in that part of my training I'm so drained I just want to leave :D. So my question is: on my "rest" days - do I still cut back my carbs by 100-150 even though I do cardio and abs? Or are they not really rest days then?

     

    Thanks.

    @kraykov If you are weighing yourself at the same time, on the same day, it should be a good gauge of what your weight is doing. Try to do it in the morning before eating or drinking so you don't have to worry so much about those affecting your numbers. Also, wait at least 2 weeks to make changes based on the numbers on the scale because like you say, you might have a week where you in-advertently drink more or sleep less which can impact the scale, but then it might bounce back to normal the week after. But if you have 2-3 weeks where things aren't progressing positively, then make changes.

     

    Yes, still cut your carbs back on those rest days. Even though you'll be doing some training, it won't be a day where you really need lots of carbs. That's the best time to go a bit lower when carb cycling. Try to do your ab training in a circuit fashion if you want to cut down on time too - you could knock out a solid ab circuit in 15-20 minutes!

  • Posted On: 09-03-18, 4:41 am (EDT) #7

    Increasing macros after cutting.

    September 3, 2018, 4:41 am
    Posted by: Scott_Herman

    @kraykov If you are weighing yourself at the same time, on the same day, it should be a good gauge of what your weight is doing. Try to do it in the morning before eating or drinking so you don't have to worry so much about those affecting your numbers. Also, wait at least 2 weeks to make changes based on the numbers on the scale because like you say, you might have a week where you in-advertently drink more or sleep less which can impact the scale, but then it might bounce back to normal the week after. But if you have 2-3 weeks where things aren't progressing positively, then make changes.

     

    Yes, still cut your carbs back on those rest days. Even though you'll be doing some training, it won't be a day where you really need lots of carbs. That's the best time to go a bit lower when carb cycling. Try to do your ab training in a circuit fashion if you want to cut down on time too - you could knock out a solid ab circuit in 15-20 minutes!

    Thanks for the time taken to answer this - sounds great and I will stick with it for a good 5-6 months.

     

    I only adopted carb-cycling in March-April this year, but I quite like it, I will 100% stick to it. And yes - I will do an ab circuit and a 15ish min HIIT/20min LISS cardio.

     

    Regarding the C&R training - I am very much looking forward to progressing more, given how the 1st three months I did were in a "cut" phase - so know with the calorie surplus it should be even better. The program is extremely demanding, but I absolutely love it.

     

    If I were to keep going with C&R for another half year - how should I proceed with the "deload week/s" - do I still go for 1 full deload week after 4 weeks of training during bulk (dropping macros accordingly, of course), or how should it ideally look like?

     

    Also, how should I be adjusting the C&R exercices when sticking with the same routine for 9-10 months? - I guess you have chosen the most fitting combination of compound, free-weight movements to create the program, but how and when should I change things up?

     

    For example, biceps/triceps are easy enough to get some variety in - swapping grips for triceps or swapping biceps curls for the lying down cable version that you made a video about a while ago - but what about larger muscle groups? What would I substitute DB chest press/pull ups/squats for? And, should I even be swapping these core exercises at all?

     

    Thanks Scott.

  • Posted On: 09-05-18, 12:39 am (EDT) #8

    Increasing macros after cutting.

    September 5, 2018, 12:39 am
    Posted by: kraykov

    Thanks for the time taken to answer this - sounds great and I will stick with it for a good 5-6 months.

     

    I only adopted carb-cycling in March-April this year, but I quite like it, I will 100% stick to it. And yes - I will do an ab circuit and a 15ish min HIIT/20min LISS cardio.

     

    Regarding the C&R training - I am very much looking forward to progressing more, given how the 1st three months I did were in a "cut" phase - so know with the calorie surplus it should be even better. The program is extremely demanding, but I absolutely love it.

     

    If I were to keep going with C&R for another half year - how should I proceed with the "deload week/s" - do I still go for 1 full deload week after 4 weeks of training during bulk (dropping macros accordingly, of course), or how should it ideally look like?

     

    Also, how should I be adjusting the C&R exercices when sticking with the same routine for 9-10 months? - I guess you have chosen the most fitting combination of compound, free-weight movements to create the program, but how and when should I change things up?

     

    For example, biceps/triceps are easy enough to get some variety in - swapping grips for triceps or swapping biceps curls for the lying down cable version that you made a video about a while ago - but what about larger muscle groups? What would I substitute DB chest press/pull ups/squats for? And, should I even be swapping these core exercises at all?

     

    Thanks Scott.

    @kraykov My pleasure! Going with 5-6 months sounds great, and carb cycling is an awesome option as well!

     

    Honestly, I wouldn't use C&R for another half year. you could probably run through the program again once more, but then maybe move onto something a little less demanding than overloading past failure every day. You can still include C&R days here and there, but probably not every day - you might even mix C&R with PPL, where one PUSH workout is C&R based, but the second PUSH workout for the week is either PUSH A, B or C.

     

    Otherwise, if you keep going with C&R, you'll probably start to burn out quicker, and quicker, and quicker, until you simply can't progress on it any more.

     

    Also, when you deload, keep your calories the same. DON'T lower them. That is your recovery week, your body still needs that extra food.

     

    There's really no need to change much with your big compounds. They should be staples every time you train those bigger muscle groups. Maybe just have some dedicated periods where you focus on DB bench press for example, and then after say 4-6 weeks of DB pressing, move to barbell pressing for 4-6 weeks. With squats, maybe do back squats for 4-6 weeks, then front squats for 4-6 weeks. Simple adjustments like that are all you need. But even with squats, back squats could probably stay the entire time as long as you deload every now and then.

     

    Hope that helps!

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